T-Vick, I'm sure your a big hit every year at the Star Trek convention. And the only one whose wife isn't inflatable but being king of nerdville doesn't make your lord over everybody else.Nobody is stopping you or any other atheist/agnostic from feeding the poor or dealing with global warming. Do you get to decide who is spending their time wisely or wasting it? Thanks for not denying our capabilities of working toward a goal. But how could you? Look at our track record. I see this in many people who have no faith in a god or religion, they think humanitarian efforts are some sort of competition. I saw a sticker on an atheist site that read "Non Believers Giving Aid, support the Haitian tragedy and beyond". C'mon, who gives a shit where the funds come from? Can't we be happy their physical needs are being met?Can't you see how your view of Secularism is the exact same thing as what you stand against. Your just replacing God with your own brand of righteousness. And just because your old religion had you chasing your tail around and was a big waste of time, doesn't mean it is for everyone.Why is it when I was a kid, and was watching Star Trek, that I wanted to be like Capt. Kirk, kick ass with that Vulcan nerve pinch thing, get with the black chic and beam myself back in time; but when you watched it you decided to become an atheist? Your Granma should have sent your little ass out to play?Anyways brotha, talk with ya soon. Peace, feen
Feeno-Actually, no, Star Trek didn't convince me to become an atheist.As I stated, it showed me a new way of thinking with valid values different from the religious values I was indoctrinate with. These ideals of humanism didn't sink in until I was an adult and could think seriously on these matters.Also I didn't say the humanitarian effort between believers and nonbelievers was a contest. Nor did I portray it as such. Basically, I agree with you–as long as the aid gets there, that's the most important thing.However, Christians have made the baseless claim that atheists are without morals. So this act of charity you rail against shows such a claim to be blatantly false. It's not a matter of competition so much as defending our integrity from cruel ad hominems such as that.So you'll excuse me if I sound crass, but I think you've overlooked some things. Also, every year the Coca-Cola Co. gives condoms to Africa to help relieve the AIDS pandemic. And every year the Catholic church instructs its followers not to use them and increases the suffering and spread of a lethal virus.Name me one secular or atheist organization which currently causes as much strife by ignoring common sense and scientific fact in such a way as to fly in the face of all reason, and I might see you having a point. Otherwise I think you've missed the point I was trying to make… which was… even without religion people can still be good, and that beyond the loss of faith, hope still exists.Star Trek simply reminded me of this hope when I was just about to struggle with the crisis which most ex-believers must contend with.
T-VickConsidering the topic which you choose to write about, and your vast intellect, I'd say your one of the nicest and most sincere bloggers out there. And I think people pick up on that. And you've never come across as "crass" to me. And if you have, I'm sure I deserved it.And if there are Christians that think atheists don't have morals, then those people are just idiots. Hopefully what they are trying to say is "where do atheists get their morals from"?The Catholic Church isn't saying "go spread AIDS" they teach to abstain from sex until marriage. Big difference.But yes, I would agree 100% with you that people with out faith can be kind and generous. I've met many of them.Peace, feeno
Feeno-Thanks! That means a lot coming from the most mild mannered and nicest Christian on the block!Also, just to clarify, the Catholic church is not only abstinence only from sex, but married couples are instructed NOT to use protection or sexual pleasure aids. So I guess it's also abstinence from protection! Sex was meant to be natural after all. My mom recently decided to remarry, and in her absolution of her prior marriage she had to go to Catholic counseling sessions with her priest and was shocked to find out that prophylactic use was a big no no. She was like, "Even if we're married?" Coming from a Protestant upbringing it didn't make any sense to her. But that's how it is. I confirmed it with my uncle, another devout Catholic.But my concern is that abstinence only doesn't work, especially in third world countries where women are still treated like chattel, and in Uganda, Ethiopia, Cambodia and other areas 60% percent of women are raped by close family members or soldiers on military raids. Condoms may be their only hope of survival. And so it's a big problem when the Catholic Bishops rant against the evils of condom usage knowing full well that these women often times have no choice in the matter. Part of the demonization (the sick and twisted psychological perk of rape) is in dominating and defiling the victim. Areas where HIV is prevalent, this is not only a crime of infanticide and genocide, and a human rights violation of the most despicable kind, but it is also a National health concern. Just think of the good that could be done if (if ONLY) the Catholic church would use its mass influence to push FOR condom use. People would beging to feel it was their religious or tribal duty to follow through–at least the religious ones anyway. And this could help turn things around.Instead the Catholic church just pours salt on an open wound. That's not compassionate at all. Seriously, someone needs to knock down the Vatican's door and ask, "What would Jesus do?" Or better yet, what is the RIGHT thing to do? Let's do that.
When you stop to think about it religion has not given us that much better of an understanding of the world.And I wouldnt argue that at all. I would, however argue that "Christianity" as opposed to "religion' has helped give rise to the body of scientific knowledge we have today. Your last entry motivated me to make an entry on my blog that I've been meaning to make for awhile re: the phony war between religion and science and how they are somehow incompatible. And I agree to not allow myself to be baited into discussions with GCT that are off-topic and will endeavor to keep it relevant.
As to the science vs. religion debate… this article may or may not interest you:http://richardcarrier.blogspot.com/2010/01/flynns-pile-of-boners.html
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